ADCC Change Weight In Rules, Good Idea for MMA?

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Woody90
Date: July 19, 2010 at 11:36 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

http://www.graciemag.com/en/2010/07/adcc-changes-rules-and-marcelo-garcia-approves
There’s news out of the traditional submission grappling tournament the ADCC, which is about to kick off the tryouts stage for the 2011 event. Changes have been made to the competition rules.
Traditionally, weigh-ins would be held the day before competing. As the finals are on the second day of competition, some of the competitors would make it to the final well over the weight limit.
Now weigh-ins are to take place shortly before the athletes take to the mats for their first bout. But, even after the first match, the athletes will not be able to stray from their diets. The referees shall have the authority to request a second weight in at any time. In this case, the fighter has wiggle room of 2 kg (4.4 lbs). Should the athlete be heavier than that, they will be disqualified.
“I think it’s great,” said three-time champion of the tournament Marcelo Garcia over Twitter.
The 170lb division champion, otherwise, did not like the change. Pablo Popovitch, who defeated Garcia in Barcelona, last September, commented the new rule also on Twitter: “With this change, the 170lb division is over for me. It is impossible for me t compete right after making the weight. Next year, I will compete at the category above. I’d really liked to have a forth final in a row against Garcia to make history.”
About the rivalry with Garcia, Popovitch has a suggestion for the ADCC: “They could put Marcelo and myself in a superfight. We sure deserve it as we closed out the last three 170lb division finals.”
Another reason for the change is to preserve the athletes’ physical integrity, by avoiding extreme and dangerous weight cuts
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Summary/My 2 Cents: They changed the rules so you weigh in on the day and therefore you cant cut much weight. They also have the right to check your weight again to make sure competitors dont do any drastic short-term weight cutting. IMO this would be great for MMA, fighters will have more energy for the fights and it upholds the idea of weight divisions - it has got to the point where the vast majority of fighters cut a fair amount of weight. So IMO if everybody is doing it, why not just get rid of the whole system so MMA becomes more about fighting and less about size. I know we wont see this in the UFC because it would make drastic changes to whos fighting in what weight divison but I think its a good idea for new countries/organisations starting MMA to consider...

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: BigBadBre
Date: July 19, 2010 at 11:43 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

Summary/My 2 cents (same thing): What's with the snooze fest on Junkie, is this always how it is?

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Woody90
Date: July 19, 2010 at 11:46 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

BigBadBre said:
Summary/My 2 cents (same thing): What's with the snooze fest on Junkie, is this always how it is?
Click to expand...
:?:

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Tgilb2007
Date: July 19, 2010 at 11:51 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

Woody90 said:
http://www.graciemag.com/en/2010/07/adcc-changes-rules-and-marcelo-garcia-approves
There’s news out of the traditional submission grappling tournament the ADCC, which is about to kick off the tryouts stage for the 2011 event. Changes have been made to the competition rules.
Traditionally, weigh-ins would be held the day before competing. As the finals are on the second day of competition, some of the competitors would make it to the final well over the weight limit.
Now weigh-ins are to take place shortly before the athletes take to the mats for their first bout. But, even after the first match, the athletes will not be able to stray from their diets. The referees shall have the authority to request a second weight in at any time. In this case, the fighter has wiggle room of 2 kg (4.4 lbs). Should the athlete be heavier than that, they will be disqualified.
“I think it’s great,” said three-time champion of the tournament Marcelo Garcia over Twitter.
The 170lb division champion, otherwise, did not like the change. Pablo Popovitch, who defeated Garcia in Barcelona, last September, commented the new rule also on Twitter: “With this change, the 170lb division is over for me. It is impossible for me t compete right after making the weight. Next year, I will compete at the category above. I’d really liked to have a forth final in a row against Garcia to make history.”
About the rivalry with Garcia, Popovitch has a suggestion for the ADCC: “They could put Marcelo and myself in a superfight. We sure deserve it as we closed out the last three 170lb division finals.”
Another reason for the change is to preserve the athletes’ physical integrity, by avoiding extreme and dangerous weight cuts
Click to expand...
Summary/My 2 Cents: They changed the rules so you weigh in on the day and therefore you cant cut much weight. They also have the right to check your weight again to make sure competitors dont do any drastic short-term weight cutting. IMO this would be great for MMA, fighters will have more energy for the fights and it upholds the idea of weight divisions - it has got to the point where the vast majority of fighters cut a fair amount of weight. So IMO if everybody is doing it, why not just get rid of the whole system so MMA becomes more about fighting and less about size. I know we wont see this in the UFC because it would make drastic changes to whos fighting in what weight divison but I think its a good idea for new countries/organisations starting MMA to consider...
Click to expand...
I think there are some other things to consider here. It will be forcing MANY competitors hands into competing into a more natural weight class, but I don't agree with testing soon before a match. Even cutting a couple added pounds can add to exhausting, dehydration, and loss of focus on the upcoming match. Those factors could also lead into more injuries for the competitors there.
I do agree that weight cutting should be VERY carefully monitored, and a certain percentage of weight could be allowed to be lost leading into a fight, but not allowing the weigh-ins on the day of the fight.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: ACOGSCOPE
Date: July 19, 2010 at 11:53 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

terrible idea. ADCC is more set up like colegiate wrestling. Its almost amature(I know its not), but MMA is a different crop than ADCC

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Woody90
Date: July 19, 2010 at 11:59 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

@Tgilb2007 Obviously there will be come finers points for regulation that need to be considered in terms of how much weight they can put back on after they weigh in, but I think if they were able to limit weight cutting to an absolute minimum so fighters are forced to fight in their natural weight classes it would only be beneficial, fighters will have more energy and imo it will ultimately lead to less injuries. But your right it will be hard to find a balance so fighters dont try anything crazy.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Woody90
Date: July 20, 2010 at 12:01 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

ACOGSCOPE said:
terrible idea. ADCC is more set up like colegiate wrestling. Its almost amature(I know its not), but MMA is a different crop than ADCC
Click to expand...
Different crop of what? and what exactly makes it a terrible idea?

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Tgilb2007
Date: July 20, 2010 at 12:03 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

Woody90 said:
@Tgilb2007 Obviously there will be come finers points for regulation that need to be considered in terms of how much weight they can put back on after they weigh in, but I think if they were able to limit weight cutting to an absolute minimum so fighters are forced to fight in their natural weight classes it would only be beneficial, fighters will have more energy and imo it will ultimately lead to less injuries. But your right it will be hard to find a balance so fighters dont try anything crazy.
Click to expand...
There HAS to be a limit at some point. Rumble weighed close to 250lbs? By fight night (at MW), means he is down to 185, cutting 26% of their weight, is just plain insane. I think a limit of around 15% or so is the MAX. Not only are you limited to a few pounds for the heavier guys (face it, Lesnar can probably get 10lbs by eating dinner), it also helps level the playing field.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: ACOGSCOPE
Date: July 20, 2010 at 12:09 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

Woody90 said:
ACOGSCOPE said:
terrible idea. ADCC is more set up like colegiate wrestling. Its almost amature(I know its not), but MMA is a different crop than ADCC
Click to expand...
Different crop of what? and what exactly makes it a terrible idea?
Click to expand...
Professional is what I am trying to distinguish the two. Making weight the day of is amatuerish(Not really though). Prize fighting should have weigh ins the night before that way paying fans can see the best fighter possible.
I dont think fighting on the day of weigh ins will do anything. fighters will still find a way to fight regardless how much weight they are cutting. It wont negate them from cutting to 170 if they fight 170 b/4 rule change.
While I see why you want to weigh in the day of in ADCC, I cant see that for prize fighting. Too much is on the line.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: ModestMMA
Date: July 20, 2010 at 12:10 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

Such a rule change would destroy all the weight classes and because of this it won't happen. It would also rob wrestlers of their much practiced weight cutting skill.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: ACOGSCOPE
Date: July 20, 2010 at 12:13 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

Tgilb2007 said:
Woody90 said:
@Tgilb2007 Obviously there will be come finers points for regulation that need to be considered in terms of how much weight they can put back on after they weigh in, but I think if they were able to limit weight cutting to an absolute minimum so fighters are forced to fight in their natural weight classes it would only be beneficial, fighters will have more energy and imo it will ultimately lead to less injuries. But your right it will be hard to find a balance so fighters dont try anything crazy.
Click to expand...
There HAS to be a limit at some point. Rumble weighed close to 250lbs? By fight night (at MW), means he is down to 185, cutting 26% of their weight, is just plain insane. I think a limit of around 15% or so is the MAX. Not only are you limited to a few pounds for the heavier guys (face it, Lesnar can probably get 10lbs by eating dinner), it also helps level the playing field.
Click to expand...
It would be impossible to keep tabs on fighters weights when they are not fighting. Some guys are built to cut weight, some arent. The younger you are, the easier it will be to cut wieght, the older you get, it is much harder.
All is fair if they agree to meet at a certain weight and both fighters make it. Both fighters know what there bodys can handle in terms of weight cutting. Dan Downes from our gym fought Chris Hordecki on 3 days notice. He lost 23 lbs in 3 days. 3 days. He had no camp, no advance diet, wasnt even training. He weighed in at 178 lbs 3 days before the fight. that is insane. Most fighters fight LW try to walk around 165ish the week of the fight. Not 178.
So if he could handle a large cut like that, I dont see why its such a huge deal.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Tgilb2007
Date: July 20, 2010 at 12:13 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

ModestMMA said:
Such a rule change would destroy all the weight classes and because of this it won't happen. It would also rob wrestlers of their much practiced weight cutting skill.
Click to expand...
Yes and no. It will certainly shake things up a lot within the weight divisions, but it wouldn't destroy anything. Guys like GSP and Anderson Silva would be safe, since, while they cut, its not an extreme.
And, yea, wrestlers mastered weight cutting. They also have the benefit of having 12-24hrs to rest and rehydrate before hitting the mats.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: TheLethalLefty
Date: July 20, 2010 at 12:26 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

I think the Ohio State Athletic Commission has a special weigh in rule where you have to weight in the next day (the day of the fight) and you get a 5 pound allowance. I'm gonna look it up but would you nay-sayers be opposed to something like that?

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: TheLethalLefty
Date: July 20, 2010 at 12:38 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

Ohio State Athletic Commission day of fight weight in rules:
(E) When a weigh-in is conducted the day prior to the event, with the exception of the heavyweight and super heavyweight class, all other contestants may be required to weigh-in at a second weigh-in the next day scheduled by the commission within eight hours of the starting time of the event. Contestants weighing one hundred fifty-five pounds and lower will not be permitted to exceed the weight of the previous weigh-in by more than eight pounds. A contestant weighing more than one hundred fifty-five pounds will not be permitted to gain. more than thirteen pounds, from their recorded weight from the day prior. The random second day weigh-in will be at the discretion of the executive director.
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I'm not sure if this is exclusive to the OSAC, but I found it on their website.
So what do you guys think about that rule? Fair? Unfair? I just wanna know what you all think. Personally, I think its a fantastic rule. If anything, I think it might even be a bit too lenient. I honestly wouldn't mind if it was a 6-7 pound allowance for fighters under 155 and 10 pounds for fighters over 155.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Woody90
Date: July 20, 2010 at 03:50 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

I think its a good rule, I know in some boxing commissions theres a similar rule because there were a few incidents where fighters cut a lot of weight and actually hurt their opponents due to the fact they were so much bigger and hit a lot harder (i will try and find the actually cases).
For me any regulation that assures fighters are the same size and upholds their health/performance can only be good. Weight classes were made for a reason, to me weight cutting is kind of a loop hole that every fighter now uses to try and get bigger than their opponent.
In most cases fighters are the same size so why not just eliminate the whole process so the fighters can perform better rather than starve themselves?

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Portillo
Date: July 20, 2010 at 03:57 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

I dunno about the idea where refs can call a weigh in.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: vfrex
Date: July 20, 2010 at 05:47 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

ACOGSCOPE said:
Professional is what I am trying to distinguish the two. Making weight the day of is amatuerish(Not really though). Prize fighting should have weigh ins the night before that way paying fans can see the best fighter possible.
I dont think fighting on the day of weigh ins will do anything. fighters will still find a way to fight regardless how much weight they are cutting. It wont negate them from cutting to 170 if they fight 170 b/4 rule change.
While I see why you want to weigh in the day of in ADCC, I cant see that for prize fighting. Too much is on the line.
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There is no way for a fighter to cut weight as they do today if weigh ins are on the day of the event. The human body can only absorb so much water at a time. There is no way that fighters could attain a level of dehydration that they do when weigh ins are 24h before.
My biggest issue is with consistency. If a fighter needs to be walking into the ring at 170-175 in one state, but can be 185 in the next, there will be confusion and mistakes. Also, fighters will have more difficulty taking fights on short notice in states that require fighters to be at the weight limit on the day of. If every state shifted to weigh ins on the day of, fighters would either move to the next weight class up or find a diet that puts them at the natural weight.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: BlindBanshee
Date: July 20, 2010 at 06:20 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

ACOGSCOPE said:
All is fair if they agree to meet at a certain weight and both fighters make it.
Click to expand...
^This.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: darcebandit
Date: July 20, 2010 at 07:20 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

I don't like it, cutting weight is a skill in itself. I am more than happy to see Popovitch at 170, the dude is a beast and his size doesn't change his match-ups with Garcia as Garcia doesn't use any strength in his Jiu Jitsu mostly leverage and his squeeze(dude could choke out a rhino). I much prefer the weigh ins the way they are, if you are 300lbs and think you can cut to 170 then go right ahead, I wanna see that. The LW champ Edgar doesn't cut much if anything at all and he does very very well at that weight, what you lose in strength you gain in conditioning and speed. AS doesn't have any cut for 205 and he beat former champ Forrest Griffin at his ease and I reckon he would win that title too so the guys who cut gain some advantage strength-wise but there are still alot of guys who do very very well without cutting much.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: darcebandit
Date: July 20, 2010 at 07:27 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/adcc-change-weight-in-rules-good-idea-for-mma.28092/

BigBadBre said:
Summary/My 2 cents (same thing): What's with the snooze fest on Junkie, is this always how it is?
Click to expand...
All you have done on this message board so far is post pictures in the wrestling thread and b---- about how boring this place is, go back to the TNA/WWE forum if you aren't gonna contribute anything here.