Originally posted by: Bredman1982 Date: April 19, 2014 at 11:31 PM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Budders said:
Lol, serious? Cain's ground and pound and vicious, it's one of his best tools and if he gets Werdum on the ground whether it be with a takedown or a knock down he isn't going to let him stand up. I'm not saying he isn't going to worry about his submissions, but when your perhaps the best in the world and Ground and Pound you're not going to not go to the ground with someone regardless of who it is.
Cain would beat Fedor.
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Cain has never fought anybody on the same planet as fabricio when it comes to the ground game. If he recklessly enters werdums guard he isn't fighting a smart fight and looking for major trouble. And I don't know if Cain beats a pride fedor. Maybe the fedor we saw at the end but he would get wrecked imo if he fought fedor in pride. Cain doesn't like being hit in the least bit. He showed that against Kongo
Originally posted by: Budders Date: April 19, 2014 at 11:31 PM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
whatdupdoh said:
Listen here young pup.
What does Cain beating fedor have to do with Cain vs werdum and fedor vs werdum?
Fedors ground n pound was/is better than Cains. And so was his submission defense
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I don't know you're the one who brought it up?
Originally posted by: Bredman1982 Date: April 19, 2014 at 11:33 PM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
whatdupdoh said:
Listen here young pup.
What does Cain beating fedor have to do with Cain vs werdum and fedor vs werdum?
Fedors ground n pound was/is better than Cains. And so was his submission defense
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Fedor also had the most dangerous armbar from his guard that I have ever seen at HW. Whether it be belly up or down. His hip movement from bottom was like lighting and once he got it there wasn't no getting out of it .
Originally posted by: Budders Date: April 19, 2014 at 11:34 PM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Bredman1982 said:
Cain has never fought anybody on the same planet as fabricio when it comes to the ground game. If he recklessly enters werdums guard he isn't fighting a smart fight and looking for major trouble. And I don't know if Cain beats a pride fedor. Maybe the fedor we saw at the end but he would get wrecked imo if he fought fedor in pride. Cain doesn't like being hit in the least bit. He showed that against Kongo
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Perhaps, but he certainly won't try to stay away from Werdums guard if given the chance to do some damage with his Ground and Pound. Cain wouldn't "recklessly" enter his guard. He is a calculated fighter and I'm sure he'll work very hard at his submission defense, top and bottom game before this fight. Thinking he's going to avoid his strength because it's someone else I think is incorrect. I mean Junior was supposed to be the better striker and Cain stood and banged with him and won.
Originally posted by: Bredman1982 Date: April 19, 2014 at 11:51 PM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Budders said:
Perhaps, but he certainly won't try to stay away from Werdums guard if given the chance to do some damage with his Ground and Pound. Cain wouldn't "recklessly" enter his guard. He is a calculated fighter and I'm sure he'll work very hard at his submission defense, top and bottom game before this fight. Thinking he's going to avoid his strength because it's someone else I think is incorrect. I mean Junior was supposed to be the better striker and Cain stood and banged with him and won.
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The only way I see Cain willingly entering werdums guard is if he has him hurt and is looking to finish. Especially in the first couple rounds when they're not too sweaty. And not sure what your definition of calculated is but I don't see that with cains GNP. Not saying he's gonna be an easy sub for werdum but it looks rather wild to me at times which isn't a bad thing cause that's what you have to do to get a finish a lot of times. But he better be careful with fabricio cause if he makes one mistake he could be in a lot of trouble. I mean the guy does have the best triangle, offensive and defensive guard in the whole world at any weight imo. I will admit if it goes past the third though werdum is in trouble. Cains cardio will take over
Originally posted by: renjr84 Date: April 20, 2014 at 12:17 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
We have all seen if you train in sub D enough and get good you can nullify an excellent BJJ persons guard..
Munoz did it to Maia, GSP did it to Penn, Lesnar did it to Mir, Overeem to Mir, as long as you are cautious and calculated in your ground and pound and have good sub D, being in a great BJJ persons guard is not that scary
Originally posted by: renjr84 Date: April 20, 2014 at 12:18 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
whatdupdoh said:
I'm pulling for werdum but I won't be putting my money where my mouth is. Cain is hard to bet against.
But to say Cain has better stand up is misleading. Cain gets away with his stand up because people are scared of the takedown. Now I actually think werdum will want the fight standing but he's not gonna be the least bit scared of the TD.
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Cain is faster which means everything in the world in this fight.. just like he beat Jr to the punch and Big Nog he will probably beat Werdum to the punch as well
Originally posted by: thedarkwingduck2k11 Date: April 20, 2014 at 12:32 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
renjr84 said:
Cain is faster which means everything in the world in this fight.. just like he beat Jr to the punch and Big Nog he will probably beat Werdum to the punch as well
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cain is always busy doing damage while he's grinding you out, probably the best at it. you see jds messed up face? that wasn't from powerful shots but accumulated shots. you hit a 3rd degree bjj black belt a couple of times and he becomes a 2nd degree, you hit enough times and he becomes a white belt.
Originally posted by: renjr84 Date: April 20, 2014 at 12:34 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
thedarkwingduck2k11 said:
cain is always busy doing damage while he's grinding you out, probably the best at it. you see jds messed up face? that wasn't from powerful shots but accumulated shots. you hit a 3rd degree bjj black belt a couple of times and he becomes a 2nd degree, you hit enough times and he becomes a white belt.
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I agree.. and u best be lucky we didnt bet
Originally posted by: pridefighter27 Date: April 20, 2014 at 12:35 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Originally posted by: thedarkwingduck2k11 Date: April 20, 2014 at 12:36 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
renjr84 said:
I agree.. and u best be lucky we didnt bet
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i knew werdum's striking was underrated, so i had an intuition to stay away from the browne/werdum match
Originally posted by: Bredman1982 Date: April 20, 2014 at 12:40 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
renjr84 said:
We have all seen if you train in sub D enough and get good you can nullify an excellent BJJ persons guard..
Munoz did it to Maia, GSP did it to Penn, Lesnar did it to Mir, Overeem to Mir, as long as you are cautious and calculated in your ground and pound and have good sub D, being in a great BJJ persons guard is not that scary
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I highly disagree. Maia couldn't cut it at 185 IMO. His cardio was bad and he wasn't big enough for the division to use his grappling skills. Gsp was the much much stronger man when he faced penn that last time and BJ's cardio was also horrible at WW from what I saw. Bad comparisons. Mir is just flat out overrated. Not surprised to see Brock and especially overeem play in mirs guard successfully. Like I said werdum is on another level when it hits the mat. Not only has he proved that with a gi but he has also proved it in mma also. The only other guy in mma I could possibly compare when it comes to being in someone's guard is vinny. Nobody at LHW wants to be in there either. Not that phil needed to but he obviously didn't even think about it lol
Originally posted by: MysterLynch Date: April 20, 2014 at 01:36 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Bredman1982 said:
I highly disagree. Maia couldn't cut it at 185 IMO. His cardio was bad and he wasn't big enough for the division to use his grappling skills. Gsp was the much much stronger man when he faced penn that last time and BJ's cardio was also horrible at WW from what I saw. Bad comparisons. Mir is just flat out overrated. Not surprised to see Brock and especially overeem play in mirs guard successfully. Like I said werdum is on another level when it hits the mat. Not only has he proved that with a gi but he has also proved it in mma also. The only other guy in mma I could possibly compare when it comes to being in someone's guard is vinny. Nobody at LHW wants to be in there either. Not that phil needed to but he obviously didn't even think about it lol
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Maia, at MW, walked around at 190. He was a small MW.
Originally posted by: thedarkwingduck2k11 Date: April 20, 2014 at 02:21 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Bredman1982 said:
Cain doesn't like being hit in the least bit. He showed that against Kongo
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i have to disagreed. kongo did get him good, but cain's chin still prevailed. He also walked into JDS's punches and showed no respect for his power whatsoever. Cain is not afraid of being punch
Originally posted by: magnuml Date: April 20, 2014 at 11:04 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Originally posted by: magnuml Date: April 20, 2014 at 11:14 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Wasn't using logic with those two comments , Just saying what was on my mind. Werdum was not gassed in anyway and still lacked the power and talent to take out a man who had nothing left. Even keep him down. yes Browne is a great fighter but he is not at the level of Cain and Junior either. he has had some luck getting to that fight and I am a fan of his. If you want to be a Champion and Beat someone like Cain you better be able to finish someone when they are in that shape. I just believe their is a HUGE Gap between Cain, JDS and anyone ranked below them right now. In my opinion the only one that "
could
" beat either man is Overeem if he continues to improve his cardio and starts thinking and fighting smart. Cain will make Werdum look like a #10 Ranked fighter. Looks like we will see.
Originally posted by: whatdupdoh Date: April 20, 2014 at 11:50 PM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
thedarkwingduck2k11 said:
i have to disagreed. kongo did get him good, but cain's chin still prevailed. He also walked into JDS's punches and showed no respect for his power whatsoever. Cain is not afraid of being punch
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You speak as if JDS didn't K him O.
Originally posted by: Neonep Date: April 21, 2014 at 12:11 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Originally posted by: Watain Date: April 21, 2014 at 12:21 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
Originally posted by: thedarkwingduck2k11 Date: April 21, 2014 at 12:30 AM Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/browne-vs-werdum-winner-gets-cain-in-mehico.61890/
whatdupdoh said:
You speak as if JDS didn't K him O.
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that's the crazy part, you would think cain would be leery of JDS' power after the first fight. but nope he continued to chase JDS and be the aggressor.
