more effective takedown system judo or wrestling

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: thedarkwingduck2k11
Date: March 16, 2014 at 03:23 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

I was hoping the mcmann vs rousey fight would give us more insight into this debate but it ended too early. however this question was raised up again in the lombard vs shields fight. seems like more fighters are still unprepared for the judo techniques than they are against the single and double takedowns. Also judo is about throwing your opponent off balance and seems a lot less energy is exerted than the conventional wrestling takedowns. interested in what you guys think about this

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: mabrown45
Date: March 16, 2014 at 03:25 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

always depends on the fighter, Judo takedowns seem to be more "violent" of sorts. They end up being more flashy so people take more notice.
Judo might be better to actually get a fighter down, but wrestling could be better at keeping them down

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: thedarkwingduck2k11
Date: March 16, 2014 at 03:27 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

mabrown45 said:
always depends on the fighter, Judo takedowns seem to be more "violent" of sorts. They end up being more flashy so people take more notice.
Judo might be better to actually get a fighter down, but wrestling could be better at keeping them down
Click to expand...
yeah i think that too, perfect example is machida, he seems great at taking down people easily but it's hard for him to keep them down and do damage.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: thedoop
Date: March 16, 2014 at 03:57 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

I'd say it depends on the situation
but leaning towards judo, violent throws that leave you in a great position on the ground usually side control etc

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: pridefighter27
Date: March 16, 2014 at 04:05 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

I love the "Violent Judo Throws", they happen so quick, and surprise the opponent.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: NicoSuave
Date: March 16, 2014 at 04:12 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

Judo

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: cmvideo75
Date: March 16, 2014 at 07:42 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

Judo is cooler. I think you need to be pretty high level in Judo though to use it successfully in MMA. You can just be a decent wrestler and still be able to use it to some effect in the cage.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: redstar
Date: March 16, 2014 at 07:56 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

In the US it's probably wrestling. The way it is trained here is pretty highly institutionalized.
Judo in Japan is taught/trained in a similar fashion, every day, multiple hours a day, from early childhood.
The draw back with Judo as it relates to MMA is the reliance on gripping your opponents clothes.
I talked to my Judo teacher about this, he was a national champion in both Judo & Greco.
He said the perpetration is the same, so I guess it really just depends on the competitor & their approach to training.
As a practitioner judo has served me well in applied application off the mat.
I bartended for a lot of years & the use of foot sweeps, joint locking was useful at key times.
Other bartenders I have known who relied on skills more akin to striking have faced lawsuits & arrest.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: NiceGuy
Date: March 16, 2014 at 08:05 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

thedarkwingduck2k11 said:
seems like more fighters are still unprepared for the judo techniques than they are against the single and double takedowns.
Click to expand...
Wrestling's been around since the beginning of MMA, forcing fighters ever since to learn to defend against wrestling.. I think the reason fighters are less prepared for judo is because there haven't been many high-level judokas in the UFC pre-Rousey. Consequently, fighters train less to defend against judo since it's not seen often in the octagon.
I also think the judokas in the UFC pre-Rousey weren't world-beaters, so people sort of dismissed judo as being less effective in the cage.
Or maybe Shields is just really bad at defending against judo. I recall Sexyama throwing him around a few times.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: thedarkwingduck2k11
Date: March 16, 2014 at 08:12 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

NiceGuy said:
Wrestling's been around since the beginning of MMA, forcing fighters ever since to learn to defend against wrestling.. I think the reason fighters are less prepared for judo is because there haven't been many high-level judokas in the UFC pre-Rousey. Consequently, fighters train less to defend against judo since it's not seen often in the octagon.
I also think the judokas in the UFC pre-Rousey weren't world-beaters, so people sort of dismissed judo as being less effective in the cage.
Or maybe Shields is just really bad at defending against judo. I recall Sexyama throwing him around a few times.
Click to expand...
also maia, machida, and even jon jones have had success using judo against traditional wrestlers.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: pacifist
Date: March 16, 2014 at 08:40 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

Without top half clothing pretty equal, with clothes to grab Judo.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: cmvideo75
Date: March 16, 2014 at 10:01 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

NiceGuy said:
Wrestling's been around since the beginning of MMA, forcing fighters ever since to learn to defend against wrestling.. I think the reason fighters are less prepared for judo is because there haven't been many high-level judokas in the UFC pre-Rousey. Consequently, fighters train less to defend against judo since it's not seen often in the octagon.
I also think the judokas in the UFC pre-Rousey weren't world-beaters, so people sort of dismissed judo as being less effective in the cage.
Or maybe Shields is just really bad at defending against judo. I recall Sexyama throwing him around a few times.
Click to expand...
Ha! I'm glad you brought up Sexyama there at the end. I was trying to figure out a way to get him into this thread!
What happened to that guy? I loved him. Last time I saw him fight he was uber-tan, like he just came from a salon or something, lol. I hear he's some big Japanese singing star too. Worldly individual!

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: renjr84
Date: March 16, 2014 at 10:02 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

redstar said:
In the US it's probably wrestling. The way it is trained here is pretty highly institutionalized.
Judo in Japan is taught/trained in a similar fashion, every day, multiple hours a day, from early childhood.
The draw back with Judo as it relates to MMA is the reliance on gripping your opponents clothes.
I talked to my Judo teacher about this, he was a national champion in both Judo & Greco.
He said the perpetration is the same, so I guess it really just depends on the competitor & their approach to training.
As a practitioner judo has served me well in applied application off the mat.
I bartended for a lot of years & the use of foot sweeps, joint locking was useful at key times.
Other bartenders I have known who relied on skills more akin to striking have faced lawsuits & arrest.
Click to expand...
oh s--- is t his a bartenders fight club or something going on

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: thedarkwingduck2k11
Date: March 16, 2014 at 10:05 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

renjr84 said:
oh s--- is t his a bartenders fight club or something going on
Click to expand...
rule #1 about bartenders fight club...always leave a tip or get your *** kicked

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: KZUFCchamp2013
Date: March 16, 2014 at 10:13 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

How effective it is depends on the fighter and how well they apply the judo/wrestling to mma. There's no right or wrong answer here

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: MoJoJo
Date: March 16, 2014 at 10:33 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

TD's = Judo
Control = Wrestling
Sexy = Sexyama (just typing his name gives me the vapors)

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Spud
Date: March 17, 2014 at 05:12 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

Neither one is more effective. It depends entirely on the fighters, and particularly how well they've translated their judo/wrestling to MMA.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: GOODNIGHTIRENE
Date: March 17, 2014 at 09:42 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

Sambo b****!

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: brian04280
Date: March 17, 2014 at 10:26 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

I've done both, and it's a false dichotomy.
While the IJF has really hurt Judo, IMO, by effectively turning it into Greco Roman with a Gi; the differences between the two aren't as diverse as you'd think. Wrestling tends towards lower body takedowns (single and double leg) while judo focuses on trips and throws, but wrestling does have throws, and judo does (or used to in competition) have leg takedowns.
When rolling, for me, I can't tell where the wrestling stops and the judo begins.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Norway
Date: March 17, 2014 at 10:26 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/more-effective-takedown-system-judo-or-wrestling.61427/

The thing that ruins the whole sport for me, is when the referee stands them up, breaks the up etc. Im 100 % with Rogan on this, they should learn the escapes rather than wait for the ref.