Vicious Attack On Wendy's Worker in Queens - Fox news
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grapplethis said:
pulling it and being like "stop or i'll shoot" is different than simply gunning them down.
i have been jumped 4 or 5 times in my life and never once did i think i was going to get beat to death. obviously i could have been, but "i should kill these guys" has never been a thought i've had.
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You've been legitimately jumped 4 or 5 seperate times? Like, you were minding your business, walking down the street and a group of people just jumped out of nowhere and started beating the s--- out of you and grabbing your cash?
Really?
I don't know what is stranger... the fact that it's been so many times... or the fact that you lost track of the actual number. Do you walk around with a sign that says, "please attack me" attached to your back?
:?
osubuckeye4 said:
grapplethis said:
pulling it and being like "stop or i'll shoot" is different than simply gunning them down.
i have been jumped 4 or 5 times in my life and never once did i think i was going to get beat to death. obviously i could have been, but "i should kill these guys" has never been a thought i've had.
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You've been legitimately jumped 4 or 5 seperate times? Like, you were minding your business, walking down the street and a group of people just jumped out of nowhere and started beating the s**t out of you and grabbing your cash?
Really?
I don't know what is stranger... the fact that it's been so many times... or the fact that you lost track of the actual number.
:?
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tell the truth, if you and your friends saw grapple walking down your street, you'd probably want to jump him too.
osubuckeye4 said:
grapplethis said:
pulling it and being like "stop or i'll shoot" is different than simply gunning them down.
i have been jumped 4 or 5 times in my life and never once did i think i was going to get beat to death. obviously i could have been, but "i should kill these guys" has never been a thought i've had.
Click to expand...
You've been legitimately jumped 4 or 5 seperate times? Like, you were minding your business, walking down the street and a group of people just jumped out of nowhere and started beating the s**t out of you and grabbing your cash?
Really?
I don't know what is stranger... the fact that it's been so many times... or the fact that you lost track of the actual number.
:?
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all of them were muggings, so it's not as random as it sounds. i used to have to walk home through a really shitty neighbourhood when i was in middle school.
grapplethis said:
all of them were muggings, so it's not as random as it sounds. i used to have to walk home through a really s***ty neighbourhood when i was in middle school.
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There is a huge difference between a mugging and getting jumped.
A mugging is someone saying, "give me your wallet".
Getting jumped means you're minding your business and all of a sudden someone clocks you in the face, or you get advanced upon by a group of people looking to beat the s--- out of you.
If a group of drug addicts corners me and somewhat rationally says, "your money or your life", I'll probably just toss them my wallet rather than pull a gun out and kill them (assuming I don't know if they have guns on them and am presuming they do). If a drug addict clocks me upside the head when I'm walking down the street, and I see 5 of his friends running out of an alleyway to jump in... I'm drawing my gun if I have it on me.
I guess I'm a coward.
grapplethis said:
a mugging as in i was jumped and robbed all in one go.
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And you still feel that the more honorable action is to curl up in a fetal position and "take your beating", rather than defend yourself to the best of your power?
Wow. Have fun getting your *** kicked... I'd rather not go to the hospital or morgue.
osubuckeye4 said:
grapplethis said:
a mugging as in i was jumped and robbed all in one go.
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And you still feel that the more honorable action is to curl up in a fetal position and "take your beating", rather than defend yourself to the best of your power?
Wow. Have fun getting your *** kicked... I'd rather not go to the hospital or morgue.
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i defended myself to the best of my power. if i had had a gun as an option, i would NOT have defended myself to THAT extent. but since i was unarmed, defending myself as best possible meant trying to take out as many guys as i could before i inevitably went down.
also, the opposite of cowardice is not honour, it's bravery. nothing brave about shooting an unarmed person.
grapplethis said:
osubuckeye4 said:
grapplethis said:
a mugging as in i was jumped and robbed all in one go.
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And you still feel that the more honorable action is to curl up in a fetal position and "take your beating", rather than defend yourself to the best of your power?
Wow. Have fun getting your *** kicked... I'd rather not go to the hospital or morgue.
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i defended myself to the best of my power. if i had had a gun as an option, i would NOT have defended myself to THAT extent. but since i was unarmed, defending myself as best possible meant trying to take out as many guys as i could before i inevitably went down.
also, the opposite of cowardice is not honour, it's bravery. nothing brave about shooting an unarmed person.
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Yes there is.
For all you know, the next person they mug is your sister, mother or girlfriend and they don't stop with mugging/assault.
Don't be trigger happy, don't kill someone if all they want is money... but if they cross that line and put your physical well being in danger, you should assume that you're not the only person they've ever done this too, and even if you are... if they are capable of putting your life in danger, they are capable of putting anyone you know or care abouts life in danger down the road as well. You don't shoot to kill, you shoot to get out of the situation... hopefully you send the message to them that mugging people is really effing dumb on their part because they never know who could have a gun on them.
I guess that's just a really selfish and dishonorable way to look at it though. I wish I could be as brave as you and just empower criminals to keep mugging/jumping people by curling up in a ball and letting them take my cash.
i'm saying don't kill here. the original thing i responded to was agoniescreep talking about putting holes in heads (kill shot, no?)
defend those you love and yourself as best you can, but going so far as killing someone simply because you're defending yourself, that's another story.
also, stop acting like i'm trying to be this "better man" than you guys who would shoot these teenagers in the head for beating you up. i'm not. i'm saying i would not do it as i think it's cowardly. a coward is still a person, and a person who is no worse than i. also, none of you have done this, so i'm not calling you cowards (i would if you shot someone who was beating you up with their hands and feet.
grapplethis said:
i'm saying don't kill here. the original thing i responded to was agoniescreep talking about putting holes in heads (kill shot, no?)
defend those you love and yourself as best you can, but going so far as killing someone simply because you're defending yourself, that's another story.
also, stop acting like i'm trying to be this "better man" than you guys who would shoot these teenagers in the head for beating you up. i'm not. i'm saying i would not do it as i think it's cowardly. a coward is still a person, and a person who is no worse than i. also, none of you have done this, so i'm not calling you cowards (i would if you shot someone who was beating you up with their hands and feet.
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If a coward is no worse than you, than I would rather be a living coward than a dead badass. Especially if coward and badass are equal, but badass happens to have had his skull crushed by gangbangers, while coward put .410 buckshot in gangbangers belly. But thats why I have a gun, I dont like my odds in a fight against someone who is desperate enough to attack me in the first place. If that is cowardly then I am a coward. Using deadly force on an unarmed person who is a threat to your life is no different than using deadly force against an armed person threatening your life. Especially if you dont even know if they are armed or not. In either case you are protecting your well being. The thought of being a honorable vegetable or dead is not as appealing to me as living.
roorippin said:
grapplethis said:
i'm saying don't kill here. the original thing i responded to was agoniescreep talking about putting holes in heads (kill shot, no?)
defend those you love and yourself as best you can, but going so far as killing someone simply because you're defending yourself, that's another story.
also, stop acting like i'm trying to be this "better man" than you guys who would shoot these teenagers in the head for beating you up. i'm not. i'm saying i would not do it as i think it's cowardly. a coward is still a person, and a person who is no worse than i. also, none of you have done this, so i'm not calling you cowards (i would if you shot someone who was beating you up with their hands and feet.
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If a coward is no worse than you, than I would rather be a living coward than a dead badass. Especially if coward and badass are equal, but badass happens to have had his skull crushed by gangbangers, while coward put .410 buckshot in gangbangers belly. But thats why I have a gun, I dont like my odds in a fight against someone who is desperate enough to attack me in the first place. If that is cowardly then I am a coward. Using deadly force on an unarmed person who is a threat to your life is no different than using deadly force against an armed person threatening your life. Especially if you dont even know if they are armed or not. In either case you are protecting your well being. The thought of being a honorable vegetable or dead is not as appealing to me as living.
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I'm watching Top 20 Most Shocking (Citizens Under Attack) on TruTV right now.
When I actually see a jump going down on video, there is no question I would pull out a gun if I had one.
Would I shoot to kill? No. Would I shoot to maim? Yes. One bullet in the leg or foot and I bet you they would stop pretty f---ing quick.
However if they said, "Give us your wallet or we will beat the s--- out of you." I would give them my wallet.
Then I would call the cops, and make sure to cancel any credit or debit cards I have in my wallet.
roorippin said:
grapplethis said:
i'm saying don't kill here. the original thing i responded to was agoniescreep talking about putting holes in heads (kill shot, no?)
defend those you love and yourself as best you can, but going so far as killing someone simply because you're defending yourself, that's another story.
also, stop acting like i'm trying to be this "better man" than you guys who would shoot these teenagers in the head for beating you up. i'm not. i'm saying i would not do it as i think it's cowardly. a coward is still a person, and a person who is no worse than i. also, none of you have done this, so i'm not calling you cowards (i would if you shot someone who was beating you up with their hands and feet.
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If a coward is no worse than you, than I would rather be a living coward than a dead badass. Especially if coward and badass are equal, but badass happens to have had his skull crushed by gangbangers, while coward put .410 buckshot in gangbangers belly. But thats why I have a gun, I dont like my odds in a fight against someone who is desperate enough to attack me in the first place. If that is cowardly then I am a coward. Using deadly force on an unarmed person who is a threat to your life is no different than using deadly force against an armed person threatening your life. Especially if you dont even know if they are armed or not. In either case you are protecting your well being. The thought of being a honorable vegetable or dead is not as appealing to me as living.
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i'm glad you called me a bad ***, because i certainly don't think that's true, but thanks.
I don't really understand Grapple's stance in this "debate". He is saying you're a coward if you draw a gun and shoot somebody who is in the process of "jumping" you with a group of people. So someone is a coward for protecting themselves against a group of people who are physically assaulting them? That makes no sense to me.
Grapple, I have a question. If you had a gun on you, that you were carrying legally, during one of the times you got jumped by multiple people, would you have pulled it out? Also, if you had pulled it and warned them off, but the still came at you, would you have shot them?
As an Englishman who doesn't have to worry about carrying a gun, my personal feeling is that if you are getting "jumped" by multiple people, whether it is mugging or just a random assault, you use whatever you can to defend yourself. If you see a brick on the ground, you pick it up and hit them with it. If you live in America, and carry a gun legally, you pull it out and shoot them until they stop attacking you. If that means you have to shoot them all, then you shoot them all.
If you're carrying the gun illegally, you're probably a criminal, so you shoot them and then rob them :lol:
Castellammarese said:
I don't really understand Grapple's stance in this "debate".
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Grapples stance is.....
1. He hates guns.
2. He loves to hijack threads involving guns to push his own moral code and liberal agenda. This thread was actually not about guns see what he did there?
3. He never has a stance. He is a whirl wind of useless half facts and nonsense.
Castellammarese said:
As an Englishman who doesn't have to worry about carrying a gun, my personal feeling is that if you are getting "jumped" by multiple people, whether it is mugging or just a random assault, you use whatever you can to defend yourself. If you see a brick on the ground, you pick it up and hit them with it. If you live in America, and carry a gun legally, you pull it out and shoot them until they stop attacking you. If that means you have to shoot them all, then you shoot them all.
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That's a good question...
Let's say 8 guys are kicking and punching you, Grapple. You wouldn't draw your gun, because that would apparently be cowardly. What if one of those guys picked up a brick, large piece of wood, sharp piece of glass... is it okay to pull your gun and shoot then (since one of them is armed)?
I'm equally confused as to what his argument is, and what his definition of cowardice and heroic actions are. You're in the clear if someone is attacking you with a weapon... but if it's a group of 8 guys with fists and feet (which can kill), you're a coward?
osubuckeye4 said:
Castellammarese said:
As an Englishman who doesn't have to worry about carrying a gun, my personal feeling is that if you are getting "jumped" by multiple people, whether it is mugging or just a random assault, you use whatever you can to defend yourself. If you see a brick on the ground, you pick it up and hit them with it. If you live in America, and carry a gun legally, you pull it out and shoot them until they stop attacking you. If that means you have to shoot them all, then you shoot them all.
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That's a good question...
Let's say 8 guys are kicking and punching you, Grapple. You wouldn't draw your gun, because that would apparently be cowardly. What if one of those guys picked up a brick, large piece of wood, sharp piece of glass... is it okay to pull your gun and shoot then (since one of them is armed)?
I'm equally confused as to what his argument is, and what his definition of cowardice and heroic actions are. You're in the clear if someone is attacking you with a weapon... but if it's a group of 8 guys with fists and feet (which can kill), you're a coward?
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If you're carrying a gun and you're being attacked by multiple people. Not drawing it and therefore not shooting them isn't brave or heroic, its idiotic. Thats what I don't get about Grapple's arguement