What is your definition of legitimately turning down a fight?

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Neonep
Date: May 18, 2017 at 02:50 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

This is something that I have been thinking about for a while and an actual discussion that we need to have. What is the legitimately turning down a fight? I was watching the Cyborg on the Big Brown Breakdown and thought about the whole situation back in January when Dana said she turned down fights but she says she wasn't healthy enough to compete.
This also reminds me of the whole thing when Dos Anjos got injured against Conor and Edgar & Aldo both turned down the fight (on short notice) and Diaz took it. Edgar was injured and it wasn't enough time for Aldo.
So my question is why do fans (many of you guys) s--- on guys for turning down fights when they have a legitimate reason to do so? Another question is what is the definition of turning down a fight? Is it you getting offered a fight but legitimately can't compete or is it not accepting a fight because it's just a rough fight or it doesn't fit when you want to fight or is it something else?

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: brian04280
Date: May 18, 2017 at 03:47 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

I tend not to s--- on fighters for turning down fights, but in my opinion it's a sense of ownership, like "we supported this through the years, you owe us".
I don't care the reason a fighter doesn't want to take a fight. Getting into the octagon with someone who by definition is going to want to hurt you, isn't something you should do half assed.
Now, if you want to say that the UFC has a responsibility to make sure their title is defended and strip this guy or that for not defending it, that's somewhat legitimate.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Gnarcore
Date: May 18, 2017 at 03:59 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Money, injury, validity, timing and wife issues.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: PejaPolo
Date: May 18, 2017 at 04:13 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Anything but a documented real deal injury is turning down a fight. Toe hurts? f--- off. Broken toe with an x-ray or pic of it crooked as hell all purple...Alright I guess that works.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: John8204
Date: May 18, 2017 at 04:20 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

I don't have an issue with guys turning down fights, I have an issue with guys ducking challenger(s). And really it's when you do it multiple times it's an issue, Diaz Brothers, Anderson Silva, Michael Bisping, Jose Aldo, Rashad Evans, Fabricio Werdum, Cain Velasquez etc etc etc

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: abc0331
Date: May 18, 2017 at 04:33 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Tired of tough guys ducking fights.
I do not care who the champion wants to fight.
Nor the tenth ranked fighter. Match them up in competitive match ups that will provide entertaining fights for fans and fighters can work there way up.
If they pass on a fight too many times they should be let go and owe money back from there contract.
The Diaz's should have been shown the door a long time ago. Cowardly actions from such 'tough guys'.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: DoctorStoppage
Date: May 18, 2017 at 04:59 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Legitimate reasons to turn down a fight offer....
* you're injured
* you don't have enough time to properly prepare
* you just fought on a recent show and aren't ready to compete, which could be a combination of the previous two reasons
* you're being offered an opponent who is so far below you in the rankings and in general skill level that it would be a waste of your time (like, if Robbie Lawler rejected a fight against Sage Northcutt, only a fool would claim that Lawler was "ducking" Northcutt)
* less common, but you're being offered an opponent who is so far ABOVE you in the rankings and in general skill level that it would be a huge risk that would likely get you hurt (like, Sage Northcutt would hopefully have the good sense to reject a fight against Robbie Lawler)
* you are a #1 contender (via Dana's own statements and/or the UFC's own rankings) but they want to put you into another fight with another challenger since the champ is busy with injury/superfight in another division. I think it's justified to turn down another contenders' fight if you've already been guaranteed a title opportunity.
* there are some behind-the-scenes contract shenanigans that we don't know about

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: abc0331
Date: May 18, 2017 at 05:12 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

DoctorStoppage said:
Legitimate reasons to turn down a fight offer....
* you're injured
* you don't have enough time to properly prepare
* you just fought on a recent show and aren't ready to compete, which could be a combination of the previous two reasons
* you're being offered an opponent who is so far below you in the rankings and in general skill level that it would be a waste of your time (like, if Robbie Lawler rejected a fight against Sage Northcutt, only a fool would claim that Lawler was "ducking" Northcutt)
* less common, but you're being offered an opponent who is so far ABOVE you in the rankings and in general skill level that it would be a huge risk that would likely get you hurt (like, Sage Northcutt would hopefully have the good sense to reject a fight against Robbie Lawler)
* you are a #1 contender (via Dana's own statements and/or the UFC's own rankings) but they want to put you into another fight with another challenger since the champ is busy with injury/superfight in another division. I think it's justified to turn down another contenders' fight if you've already been guaranteed a title opportunity.
* there are some behind-the-scenes contract shenanigans that we don't know about
Click to expand...
So what would be illegitimate reason?

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Reckin007
Date: May 18, 2017 at 05:20 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

I'll be disappointed when marquee matchups are missed or if there are no substitutes for injuries but they can do whatever they want. I'm not getting in there. This idea of "ducking" is the most absurd fan entitlement garbage in MMA.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Slingshot
Date: May 18, 2017 at 07:08 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Germaine De Randamie is my definition of it.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Reckin007
Date: May 18, 2017 at 07:18 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Slingshot said:
Germaine De Randamie is my definition of it.
Click to expand...
So the chick who has fought in combat sports professionally for 15 years?

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Spidy
Date: May 18, 2017 at 07:33 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Neonep said:
This is something that I have been thinking about for a while and an actual discussion that we need to have. What is the legitimately turning down a fight? I was watching the Cyborg on the Big Brown Breakdown and thought about the whole situation back in January when Dana said she turned down fights but she says she wasn't healthy enough to compete.
This also reminds me of the whole thing when Dos Anjos got injured against Conor and Edgar & Aldo both turned down the fight (on short notice) and Diaz took it. Edgar was injured and it wasn't enough time for Aldo.
So my question is why do fans (many of you guys) s--- on guys for turning down fights when they have a legitimate reason to do so? Another question is what is the definition of turning down a fight? Is it you getting offered a fight but legitimately can't compete or is it not accepting a fight because it's just a rough fight or it doesn't fit when you want to fight or is it something else?
Click to expand...
See Nick and Nate Diaz circa 2017

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Tum Tum
Date: May 18, 2017 at 11:30 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Neonep said:
This is something that I have been thinking about for a while and an actual discussion that we need to have. What is the legitimately turning down a fight? I was watching the Cyborg on the Big Brown Breakdown and thought about the whole situation back in January when Dana said she turned down fights but she says she wasn't healthy enough to compete.
This also reminds me of the whole thing when Dos Anjos got injured against Conor and Edgar & Aldo both turned down the fight (on short notice) and Diaz took it. Edgar was injured and it wasn't enough time for Aldo.
So my question is why do fans (many of you guys) s--- on guys for turning down fights when they have a legitimate reason to do so? Another question is what is the definition of turning down a fight? Is it you getting offered a fight but legitimately can't compete or is it not accepting a fight because it's just a rough fight or it doesn't fit when you want to fight or is it something else?
Click to expand...
Most reasonable fans shouldn't and don't crap on guys for turning down fights legitimately. Disappointment that a major fight isn't happening sets in but most understand it's the nature of the sport. Injuries, family emergency, sickness and other things (like religious observance) are understood by fans. However, the criticism you are talking about isn't about people turning down fights. It's about fighters (mostly champions) sitting on the sideline when it "looks" like they have nothing holding them back from accepting a fight and are asking for ridiculous concessions that are not legitimate.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: CardioKing
Date: May 19, 2017 at 12:45 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Gnarcore said:
Money, injury, validity, timing and wife issues.
Click to expand...
diarrhea, dog gets hit by car, no one to water your grass while you're out of the country, owe a bookie money in Las Vegas

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Neonep
Date: May 19, 2017 at 01:20 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

I remember people shitting on Aldo & Edgar a bit when they turned down the McGregor fight on short notice.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: ChrisminaL
Date: May 19, 2017 at 05:04 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Turning down a fight is when you are offered one and you say no.
If you're under contract, it is the athlete's management job to let UFC know if a fighter is injured.
Therefore, if the UFC offers someone a fight and the someone says no, he/she turns it down.
Exception: "Not for this date, but 2 weeks before/after works for me".

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: Spud
Date: May 19, 2017 at 06:06 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

There are plenty legit reasons for turning down a fight, including a lot of stuff fans might not think about. Sometimes it's about timing, maybe a guy has a holiday booked or a few niggling injuries that aren't particularly serious, but he wants a bit of time to heal up.
I also think that for developing fighters in particular, turning down fights based on the match up is perfectly legit. In MMA, it's up to the fighter and their management to control their career path. In boxing you'll see promoters care of their developing prospects a hell of a lot more, we don't see that so much in the ufc so it's up to the fighters to do that themselves, and sometimes that means turning down bad stylistic fights early in their career.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: ChrisminaL
Date: May 19, 2017 at 07:55 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Spud said:
There are plenty legit reasons for turning down a fight, including a lot of stuff fans might not think about. Sometimes it's about timing, maybe a guy has a holiday booked or a few niggling injuries that aren't particularly serious, but he wants a bit of time to heal up.
I also think that for developing fighters in particular, turning down fights based on the match up is perfectly legit. In MMA, it's up to the fighter and their management to control their career path. In boxing you'll see promoters care of their developing prospects a hell of a lot more, we don't see that so much in the ufc so it's up to the fighters to do that themselves, and sometimes that means turning down bad stylistic fights early in their career.
Click to expand...
Totally.
The problem today in MMA is that the sport is what I call
made for the fans
. It's all that matters. The athletes
have to
give a great show. A fat guy will criticize or even insult an athlete who had a poor performance; even if you need 10 years of dedication to be able to make such a performance.
When an athlete turns a fight down, he is the worst guy to have ever lived. He's a pus-y.
What people don't realize is how difficult it is to get to that level (in terms of skills) and how fragile a career is. A bad Knockout and your next fight is 6 months later. Half a year, that's long ! 3 losses in your early career and you can almost say your UFC chances good bye. If you don't win twice for one loss, you can't stick around in the UFC.
If you want to make a career in MMA, you need to be clever and make the right choices. You can't just accept any fight. But the sport (fans) doesn't allow you to be clever.
If you decline fights, people hate you. And UFC don't have interest in hated athletes.
Now, of course, there's a limit. You can't just pick all the fights you need. There is no merit if there is no risk. But there should be a balance.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: CardioKing
Date: May 19, 2017 at 10:35 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

ChrisminaL said:
Totally.
If you want to make a career in MMA, you need to be clever and make the right choices. You can't just accept any fight. .
Click to expand...
What you're describing
is
borderline p----. Most guys will never hold a belt. But they want to give the illusion of being a top-tier guy. They pick and choose their fights, wait for certain people to fade out, then pop in. I find it interesting that it only takes 1-2 truly top fighters to retire or take extended breaks to completely change the landscape and guys who would have never gotten a chance start mouthing off about wanting to fight all of a sudden.
I think guys need to know their skill level. They need to accept fights based on that to some degree. But also recognize that in other sports, you compete against whoever is put in front of you. Either you get the touchdown, score the goal, shoot the three-pointer, run the 26 miles and win - or you don't. This is a little different, because it involves getting punched and kicked. But, there's a reason why so many guys stay amateur in boxing. To make sure they are actually ready to take on all comers when they go pro. Perhaps more MMA fighters should delay going pro.

 

[Nastycrow]

Originally posted by: liljoe6969
Date: May 19, 2017 at 11:52 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/what-is-your-definition-of-legitimately-turning-down-a-fight.71175/

Is it legitimate when a fighter says they want to fight GSP during the summer and GSP wants to wait Til November so the UFC gets another fighter for the summer and then the original fighter can't compete?