Anderson Silva won't fight again until the end of 2013
- Thread starter Nastycrow
- Start date
Based off of AS quotes its clear he wants big $ fights. I don't think GSP really wants to fight AS at the moment. If GSP beats Condit impressively, he will prob be more receptive to AS. The only other big fight for AS is JBJ and AS doesn't want it. If AS takes some time off there is the possibility of Diaz, Bisbing, Wideman or another fighter to get a big win and get hyped up to fight AS. Long story short if GSP doesn't want AS we might not see AS for a while.
Bredman1982 said:
mabrown45 said:
Bredman1982 said:
Didn't he say he wanted time off before the Bonnar fight as well? I guess this enables him to just sit back and wait to pop up and fight whom ever he chooses AKA hand picking your opponents. Another spectacular move from our so called goat. I am officially not a fan anymore
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impressive to hand pick opponents when you take a fight on 4 weeks notice against "any lhw"......of course not bones
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He fought a guy that's not even in most people's top 15 at LHW that was on his way to retirement. :lol: Wow! What a warrior!
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like the entire top 5 of the LHW division wouldn't even fight Jones...........so you think they would fight Silva?
he offered.....not his fault no one but bonnar accepted.
bob_onit said:
Heres how its gunna go down...
Condit KOs gsp in the 2nd round with a vicous head kick, throwing the superfight with silva out the window
Gsp returns and fights diaz coming off of his suspension
Jones wrecks sonnen, and
jones vs silva gets announced as the main event for ufc on fox 9
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I highly doubt they'd put Jones-Silva in Fox. The point of these superfights is to make huge profit from them via PPV sales (which is still what the UFC cares about most when it comes to revenue).
mabrown45 said:
Galgorian said:
I call BS. Anderson is just lobbying for more money in the GSP fight. Dana will do anything to make it so he fights more than that.
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mainly this...........Silva knows he holds all the power.
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I'd say that Silva thinks he holds all the power.
I do believe there's a standard one year title revocation clause. It's in GSP contract and I can't see SIlva's team, especially with the salary levels they got for Anderson, that they did any better.
The fact is, as lucrative as a super fight appears, they're not the cash windfalls for the UFC that everyone thinks they are. Yes, 1 plus million buys are great and revenues are higher, but superfights have bigger marketing and PR budgets, plus if they go to a stadium, they've never been to, a la Cowboys Stadium, they'll be scouting and logistical costs that cut into profits. It's mroe money but it ain't all gravy.
That's why you'll most likely not see Zuffa break the bank for Silva. It's why they never broke the bank for Fedor or anyone else. Factor in the Anderson is 38 and getting older, he's the one with the window that's closing. As dominant as he is, he's just a commodity that has a shelf life and the UFC has others, some of whom are more profitable.
Silva has a bit of an edge, but not much of one.
I chalk just about all the crazy stuff he has done since before the second Sonnen fight to nothing but contract renegotiating.
as a fan I will attest that if he is healthy and hasn't defended the MW belt in like 18 months since his last, he should be stripped. I would say 12 months but I will give him an extra 6 months if and only if he fights GSP.
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Like I said, I strongly suspect a 12 month clause. If so, that means Silva will fight by Oct 13th, 2013 at the latest or have signed a fight by that date. Much in line with his statement.
He's trying to hold out but he's only got one card. GSP or Jones holds the other and Zuffa has even more.
^^^^ depending on if you take what Dana said seriously they were WILLING to break the bank for fedor.
The UFC hasn't ever really had big super fights.........so they are more than likely willing to spend more to hopefully make more. It is new territory that they are willing to explore.
You are wrong on Zuffa and others holding more cards............Silva can retire right now and probably be happy. He more than likely doesn't have to fight and knows that. So if Dana wants him to continue then it will cost
mabrown45 said:
^^^^ depending on if you take what Dana said seriously they were WILLING to break the bank for fedor.
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What Dana says and what Zuffa actually does tends to be different often enough to not take those comments factually. What is clear is that they didn't break the bank for Fedor and they're no worse for it.
The UFC hasn't ever really had big super fights.........so they are more than likely willing to spend more to hopefully make more. It is new territory that they are willing to explore.
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UFC 100 was a super event. It dwarves any event before or since - by a country mile. And its budget was huge compared to regular PPVs. That this might be the first dominant champ versus dominant champ fight doesn't add any new logistical wrinkles. That's just the flavour of the event - the details will be similar.
You are wrong on Zuffa and others holding more cards............Silva can retire right now and probably be happy. He more than likely doesn't have to fight and knows that. So if Dana wants him to continue then it will cost
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And that will not impact Zuffa. Silva makes up less than 3% of their PPV revenue stream. He could retire tomorrow and Zuffa will move on without much pause. In purely monetary terms, there isn't a single fighter Zuffa couldn't afford to lose. Jones, GSP, Silva, none of them....
Zuffa holds more cards than Silva. They hold more cards than any one single fighter. Ask Couture, Henderson and Shamrock when they tried to play hard ball. If you think Silva has more than PR and retirement/leave of absence as a club, think again. It's all he's got.
What you think Silva has and what he really has - big difference. That's why he's going public - sentiment and retirement are the only things her can trade on and he's doing that now.
In short, no, not wrong. Silva is gonna play ball or go home. Beyond that, he's got bupkus. Zuffa has more sticks, more carrots and no expiry date. They can live without a superfight.
I've been saying for awhile now that Anderson should give up the title and just take interesting big money fights (like GSP, Jones, etc.). Champions need to consistently defend the title or they shouldn't be the champion and if you have no desire to fight worthy contenders then just give it up.
The UFC should just have the Bisping/Belfort winner fight the Weidman/Boetsch winner for the title.
Without a title tying things up, Anderson can fight whenever and whomever he wishes and not be beholden to defending the belt. Something like this makes a lot of sense. Anderson v. GSP at the end of 2013 in a non-title fight (thus if GSP wins he won't be the MW champion and can go back down to WW where he is more comfortable). After that a marquee LHW fight in the summer of 2014. Then if he still wants to fight he can fight whoever the MW champ is at the end of 2014 in a retirement fight for him (that way if he wins he will retire as champion).
Your examples of fighters playing hardball are first off........bad examples.......secondly that was during the "good times." When PPVs were being bought left and right. The UFC's PPV buy rates have gone down and i doubt they want to lose anymore. You mention 3% showing that its a low percentage.........but what is that number in terms of $$$
You say that the UFC can't afford to lose any single fighter.......exactly how do you know that? It might make some sense but go ahead and say "oh ya we don't need the 1mil PPV buys that any of those fighters would produce in a year." Might as well own a business and say "nah we don't need 20-30mil this year"(general estimate of expenses)
Moranis said:
I've been saying for awhile now that Anderson should give up the title and just take interesting big money fights (like GSP, Jones, etc.). Champions need to consistently defend the title or they shouldn't be the champion and if you have no desire to fight worthy contenders then just give it up.
The UFC should just have the Bisping/Belfort winner fight the Weidman/Boetsch winner for the title.
Without a title tying things up, Anderson can fight whenever and whomever he wishes and not be beholden to defending the belt. Something like this makes a lot of sense. Anderson v. GSP at the end of 2013 in a non-title fight (thus if GSP wins he won't be the MW champion and can go back down to WW where he is more comfortable). After that a marquee LHW fight in the summer of 2014. Then if he still wants to fight he can fight whoever the MW champ is at the end of 2014 in a retirement fight for him (that way if he wins he will retire as champion).
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That night be a good idea. But I think what is sponsors will play a part. I would imagine his Nike deal has a championship clause. And Nike will cut him in a heartbeat if so. Can you say Tiger Woods? He's so much more lucrative for Nike and some dicking around cost him more cash than Anderson will earn in his career.
I mean, I don't think there's a single one of us that doesn't think Silva is the greatest fighter in MMA today, but the value we on this forum place on Anderson I think vastly exceeds what the non-hardcore MMA world places on him.
mabrown45 said:
Your examples of fighters playing hardball are first off........bad examples
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Yes, you say that but frankly, it's got nothing behind it. Every single one of those guys tried to play hardball and lost. If you can name one fighter than played hardball and got something out of the UFC, be my guest.
......secondly that was during the "good times." When PPVs were being bought left and right.
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PPV volumes are up this year over last, ytd and exceed the buy rates in those good times years. Moving along...
The UFC's PPV buy rates have gone down
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Incorrect. The only year they decreased was '11 and so far in '12 they exceeded both '10 and '11s year to date.
and i doubt they want to lose anymore.
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They don't have to. Good thing PPV buys are up for 2012, ytd.
You mention 3% showing that its a low percentage
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It's less than 3% and it is a low percentage. Since the UFC is up 6% so far this year, they could absorb a 3% hit. To be clear, since you seem to be heading down a stunningly pedantic pathway, they don't want to take that hit, but if they fork out too much, they effectively wipe out any gain they might have made. No one fighter is that important. That's the strength of their business model.
You say that the UFC can't afford to lose any single fighter.......exactly how do you know that?
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Actually, I said the opposite. :roll: They can afford to lose any one single fighter. I know this because former PPV kings have come and gone, and (gasp) the UFC has got others to replace them and have gotten even bigger. It's their business model - that's why I know. There's a history of it.
It might make some sense but go ahead and say "oh ya we don't need the 1mil PPV buys that any of those fighters would produce in a year." Might as well own a business and say "nah we don't need 20-30mil this year"(general estimate of expenses)
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Well, among silly strawmen, this is one of the sillier. No one is saying the UFC doesn't want those buys, but rather that the UFC isn't going to bleed to have those buys. Not only does it set a precedent, it's negates the gains.
And I'm not saying GSP/Silva won't happen. But Silva won't get anymore than GSP or Jones currently do. $400K purse, cut of PPV, graded by volumes and locker room bonuses. Sponsorships for Silva probably don't match those of Jones or GSP - he's not as marketable in North America as those two are.
Purses are never going to be large. That's straight cash that Zuffa has to pony up a month before the fight in an escrow account - those numbers will always be low. All the real money comes out the backend and from PPV cuts.
edit;
Feel free to think Silva holds all the cards and is more valuable to the UFC than any other fighter, past or current. The numbers and I will continue to think differently.
^^^ when did i say Silva is more valuable? I say he holds all the cards.......for the fact that its his choice to fight or not depending on if Dana wants him. We are talking about Silva here and you brought up the other stars.
and good job running with a typo there "You say that the UFC can't afford to lose any single fighter.......exactly how do you know that?" Meant to say can but your constant self need to argue line by line obviously missed that.
So you assume that since the UFC is up from last year that they are willing or want to lose more? I am not saying losing 1 star will "break the bank," but why lose money when you don't have to?
mabrown45 said:
like the entire top 5 of the LHW division wouldn't even fight Jones...........so you think they would fight Silva?
he offered.....not his fault no one but bonnar accepted.
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Right! Do you work for zuffa of something? How do you know who they offered silva to? Are you saying they offered the fight to all the top ten LHW's except jones and they all declined? All your doing is repeating what Dana said. You really think silva would of took a fight on four weeks notice against guys like Evans, Davis, Gus, glover, or shogun? C'mon man this guy didn't even wanna fight sonnen the second time around and you want me to believe he would of took a fight against a top LHW on four weeks notice. Highly doubtful little buddy but good try. They offered silva to Bonnar cause they saw a chance to give Stephan the big pay day he was asking for before he retires. And another easy W for silva. Simple as that
Silva needs the tittle taken off him and made to go up to 205. he has no challenge at 185 and refuses to fight the best in that very deep devision. i think we should forget superfights for GSP and get on the bones jones train to anderson silvas first ufc loss. witch would happen if he fought the 2054 king.
Bredman1982 said:
mabrown45 said:
like the entire top 5 of the LHW division wouldn't even fight Jones...........so you think they would fight Silva?
he offered.....not his fault no one but bonnar accepted.
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Right! Do you work for zuffa of something? How do you know who they offered silva to? Are you saying they offered the fight to all the top ten LHW's except jones and they all declined? All your doing is repeating what Dana said. You really think silva would of took a fight on four weeks notice against guys like Evans, Davis, Gus, glover, or shogun? C'mon man this guy didn't even wanna fight sonnen the second time around and you want me to believe he would of took a fight against a top LHW on four weeks notice. Highly doubtful little buddy but good try. They offered silva to Bonnar cause they saw a chance to give Stephan the big pay day he was asking for before he retires. And another easy W for silva. Simple as that
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am i repeating what Dana said? I don't exactly follow everything the guy says. I am just repeating the truth.
I don't know who they offered........all i know is what silva said and what makes sense. No top LHW was going to risk fighting Silva, not when they won't even fight the current champ.
It was a replacement fight............you hate is just making you delusional
mabrown45 said:
^^^ when did i say Silva is more valuable?
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You didn't. Had you said that and I quoted you, I'd put it in quotations marks. That's how it works. Or did you fail to notice where I DIDN'T say you said that?
As it is, I'm saying he's not more valauble. Me. That's why it's in my part of the response. And it's one of the reasons why Silva doesn't hold all the cards.
I say he holds all the cards.......
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Yes, you have said that and the only card you've shown is that Silva can take his ball and go home. That might count as all the cards in your world, but it ain't in the real world. In the real world, the UFC can enjoin Silva from doing a lot of things MMA related and hurt his future revenue streams and tie him in litigation. That's be one of the many cards the UFC holds.
We are talking about Silva here and you brought up the other stars.
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Yes, to demonstrate that other stars, with greater drawing power, also don't hold all the cards. That'd be called a pattern.
and good job running with a typo there "You say that the UFC can't afford to lose any single fighter.......exactly how do you know that?" Meant to say can but your constant self need to argue line by line obviously missed that.
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Maybe you did and maybe you didn't. With the number of misquotes and strawman you make, I'll stick with the words you write. If you meant something else, then correct yourself. It's not my fault you made a mistake.
So you assume that since the UFC is up from last year that they are willing or want to lose more?
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I don't assume. We did a breakdown a month or two ago showing that exact number. Year to date, the ppv buys were up 6% over the same point last year.
(and speaking of pedantic paths I predicted, here it is) It's not about willing or wanting to lose more, they're not going to throw cash at Silva for a fight that's not going to break an estimated 1.3 million buys ( a number you yourself agreed was in the running) just to make the fight. That means they'll offer him the same as Jones/GSP. If Silva plays the ONLY card he has - the I won't fight ever again card - he'll lose his belt, they'll enforce the non performance clause like they did with Couture when he left and Silva will be the one who loses the most as a portion of revenue.
I am not saying losing 1 star will "break the bank," but why lose money when you don't have to?
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(sigh) Silva taking his ball and going home is worst case scenario and it screws Anderson over far more. If Silva wants more money than any other fighter in UFC history for this fight, it's unlikely he'll get it based on the past performances and reasonable projections. The person who can ill afford to lose that chunk of change is Silva.
I mean, he's the one that commented outright that he wants big money fights. He ain't gonna walk away from more money than he's ever made before. The UFC knows that, too. That'd be yet another card in the UFC's hand.
Silva is making the only play he can right now. Threaten and build some fan sentiment. That's it. Zuffa's got a signed document that holds a lot more clout.
Feel free to think Silva holds all the cards, but based on what you`re tossing out, he doesn`t. He might even get the fight if Georges agrees, but purse will be $400K and a cut of PPV revenue in line with GSP and Jones. Which is above the current $200K purse he has in his contract and is most likely a bigger PPV cut than he curently gets.
But the decision currently rests with GSP, not Silva. Anderson`s made his move - now he has to wait and see how the other players respond. Which is really not the position of someone holding all the cards. :lol:
Koos said:
I just can't bite my tongue any longer.....
I hate Anderson Silva!
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Why do you hate Silva?
I might think some of his actions smack of someone desperate to cash in before he's done, but how that makes him hateable escapes me.
Personally, I think he's doing what he needs to do, although I'd put his chances of being successful getting either a Jones or GSP super fight at less than 35% right now.