UFC 236 (Poirier vs Holloway II)

Originally posted by: Haraldr
Date: April 14, 2019 at 10:01 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

BlairBones said:
Definitely out of Kings. I believe he cross trains at 10th Planet for BJJ. No Mike Brown for Kelvin; he was in Poirier's corner. We all learned that Harald is a far *** way from Atlanta (given the west coast confusion) so it was probably wee hours of the morning where he was. I suspect he is melding his memories of the final two fights together.
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Yeah what a hell.
I'm just "melding memories" here, carry on.
 
Originally posted by: Mike Porch MMA
Date: April 15, 2019 at 03:10 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

Mike Porch MMA's post "UFC 236" Rankings Update (That No One Cares About
)
155
- Dustin Poirier
moves up
from #3
-
(IC)
185
- Israel Adesanya
moves up
from #3
-
(IC)
- Kelvin Gastelum
drops down
from #4
-
#6
205
- Nikita Krylov
re-enters
at #13
- Ovince Saint Preux
drops down
from #13
-
#14
125
- Alexandre Pantoja
remains
at #6
- Wilson Reis
remains
at #8
P4P
- Dustin Poirier
breaks in
at #7
- Max Holloway
drops down
from #3
-
#8
- Israel Adesanya
breaks in
at #15
 
Originally posted by: Mike Porch MMA
Date: April 15, 2019 at 04:36 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

Mike Porch MMA said:
Mike Porch MMA's post "UFC 236" Rankings Update (That No One Cares About
)
155
- Dustin Poirier
moves up
from #3
-
(IC)
185
- Israel Adesanya
moves up
from #3
-
(IC)
- Kelvin Gastelum
drops down
from #4
-
#6
205
- Nikita Krylov
re-enters
at #13
- Ovince Saint Preux
drops down
from #13
-
#14
125
- Alexandre Pantoja
remains
at #6
- Wilson Reis
remains
at #8
P4P
- Dustin Poirier
breaks in
at #7
- Max Holloway
drops down
from #3
-
#8
- Israel Adesanya
breaks in
at #15
Click to expand...
This turned out to be one of (if not the) toughest times ive had changing rankings after an event
 
Originally posted by: callithowyouseeit
Date: April 15, 2019 at 11:53 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

Sounds like I missed some pretty solid IC fights.... Sad.
 
Originally posted by: THE FIRST
Date: April 16, 2019 at 05:21 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

To me Max is a genius. He is so versatile standing up it's insane. If he will stay at 155 he will be better. Get used to weight and all. But peole really underestimate what Dustin did. When he went up a class I was saying he can fight top5 of the division ppl were laughing. But Dustin did it. And right now he has so much stamina it's crazy. This fight had such a high pace... But what Poirier did was to go in and change Max combos. Came in close and disrupted what Max wanted to do.
Amazing in this fight was that the were in pocket exchanging bit. And that's a title fight. You want to take as little risk as you can and win. They went for it.
All in all great fight. Max might consider not to go all out. His confidence was too high and pride too big not to take step back. But His top game IMO are more resets not war war mentality.
 
Originally posted by: THE FIRST
Date: April 16, 2019 at 05:25 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

I was almost sure Kelvin will win this fight. But he just overextended himself and gave Adesanya easy counter right for his left. And yup he stayed in the same spot too much and Israel could slip change angle and hit him there. Idk how was Kelvins preparations but it looked like he had no gameplan with taking fight to the ground. when he tried it was just not there.
I wonder how Knuckles can handle an impressive beast Adesana became.
 
Originally posted by: maggotbrain
Date: April 16, 2019 at 07:28 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

THE FIRST said:
To me Max is a genius. He is so versatile standing up it's insane. If he will stay at 155 he will be better. Get used to weight and all. But peole really underestimate what Dustin did. When he went up a class I was saying he can fight top5 of the division ppl were laughing. But Dustin did it. And right now he has so much stamina it's crazy. This fight had such a high pace... But what Poirier did was to go in and change Max combos. Came in close and disrupted what Max wanted to do.
Amazing in this fight was that the were in pocket exchanging bit. And that's a title fight. You want to take as little risk as you can and win. They went for it.
All in all great fight. Max might consider not to go all out. His confidence was too high and pride too big not to take step back. But His top game IMO are more resets not war war mentality.
Click to expand...
So Max is genius? Just usually do you mean?Or did he just go all out and stay in the pocket too long and not fight his smartest fight here? All similar to what I was saying. He does go into the pocket but he usually gets the distance and timing better and tries to slip out more. He thought he was untouchable and tried to trade in a slug fest vs a guy he shouldn’t have. Not the genius he’s been before, IMO. Also made no in fight adjustments..not smart
Btw, im by no means discrediting the stellar performance of Poirier. Happy to admit that savage has proven me wrong more than a few times and entertains doing do every time. Guys a f---ing stud and deserves all the credit in the world. Can’t wait to see him fight Khabib.
 
Originally posted by: redd1
Date: April 16, 2019 at 09:37 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

Max fought the same fight he always fought just against a heavier hitter and arguably should have won that fight. He put every bit as much work on Dustin as Dustin did on him except he didn't panic wrestle Dustin to keep from being finished.
 
Originally posted by: Bucho
Date: April 16, 2019 at 10:28 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

MMAFTM13 said:
As a big Kelvin fan I think he fought like an absolute dummy last night. I picked him and fully expected him to press the action more in the wrestling. He has more tools godammit! If I knew he was just going to strike then no way would I have picked him. ...
Click to expand...
MysterLynch said:
Agreed, I thought Kelvin would mix takedowns with stand-up pressure ...
Click to expand...
Dropouts in your coverage? Blackouts from your beverage?
Kelvin shot for 9 takedowns. He was throwing
EVERYFUCKINTHING HE HAD
at Izzy.
Izzy is just better.
Haraldr said:
Adesanya moves well and I guess Kelvin just didn't feel comfortable or felt it was realistic to get the takedowns on a regular basis once he was in there with him.
Click to expand...
This guy mostly gets it.
What Kelvin felt was that it wasn't realistic to get the takedowns on a regular basis because every time he attempted to take Izzy down, over and over and over and over and over and over and over, Izzy just shrugged them off like they were nothing.
And when he did get one Izzy triangled and swept him with ease.
 
Originally posted by: MysterLynch
Date: April 16, 2019 at 10:40 PM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

Bucho said:
Dropouts in your coverage? Blackouts from your beverage?
Kelvin shot for 9 takedowns. He was throwing
EVERYFUCKINTHING HE HAD
at Izzy.
Izzy is just better.
This guy mostly gets it.
What Kelvin felt was that it wasn't realistic to get the takedowns on a regular basis because every time he attempted to take Izzy down, over and over and over and over and over and over and over, Izzy just shrugged them off like they were nothing.
And when he did get one Izzy triangled and swept him with ease.
Click to expand...
And he attempted none in the first. he opted to go all out in the stand up. As he got tired looked for takedowns. The fifth round, when he was exhausted saw his most TD attempts. Israel was the better fighter, but Kelvin did not fight a smart fight and most of the TD attempts were out of fatigue then strategy, the one in the late fourth round was moronic. Had Kelvin secured a TD in the first, it likely would have seen Israel a tad more cautious.
Again, Israel was the better fighter that night, but it does not mean that Kelvin could have done better.
 
Originally posted by: Bucho
Date: April 17, 2019 at 02:03 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

MysterLynch said:
And he attempted none in the first. he opted to go all out in the stand up. As he got tired looked for takedowns. The fifth round, when he was exhausted saw his most TD attempts. Israel was the better fighter, but Kelvin did not fight a smart fight and most of the TD attempts were out of fatigue then strategy, the one in the late fourth round was moronic. Had Kelvin secured a TD in the first, it likely would have seen Israel a tad more cautious.
Again, Israel was the better fighter that night, but it does not mean that Kelvin could have done better.
Click to expand...
In the early going Israel was already fighting Kelvin cautiously. He's a naturally cautious fighter, especially in the early rounds.
And Kelvin's always been far more effective as a striker than as a wrestler. Since TUF, Kelvin's notched up 14 fights and only scored more than a single takedown in one of those outings. Leading up to Izzy he had
zero
TDs in his previous 6 fights. He may have started out in high school as a wrestler (a decade ago!!!), but even
waaaaaay
back then he wasn't even close to as credentialed as the likes of Derek Brunson, who went 0 for 7 against Izzy. There's zero evidence that Kelvin has ever had a high-level MMA wrestling game. Kelvin has much more in common with a Brad Tavares, who went 1 for 12 against Izzy, than with a Chris Weidman.
Meanwhile, those Tavares and Brunson scraps - given that both are better wrestlers than either of Izzy's earlier opponents - suggest that Izzy's TDD has improved at an exponential rate over the course of his short UFC career. Put him back in with (a clean version of) Vettori now and Vettori gets less than nothing.
 
Originally posted by: THE FIRST
Date: April 17, 2019 at 02:46 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

maggotbrain said:
So Max is genius? Just usually do you mean?Or did he just go all out and stay in the pocket too long and not fight his smartest fight here? All similar to what I was saying. He does go into the pocket but he usually gets the distance and timing better and tries to slip out more. He thought he was untouchable and tried to trade in a slug fest vs a guy he shouldn’t have.
Not the genius he’s been before, IMO. Also made no in fight adjustments..not smart
Btw, im by no means discrediting the stellar performance of Poirier. Happy to admit that savage has proven me wrong more than a few times and entertains doing do every time. Guys a f---ing stud and deserves all the credit in the world. Can’t wait to see him fight Khabib.
Click to expand...
That is what I mean. In this fight he was forced to slug more and Poirier is willing to do just that and also is way smarter in exchanges then before. I just give credit to Dustin more here.
 
Originally posted by: THE FIRST
Date: April 17, 2019 at 10:03 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

Also I am in awe how much this sport grew. Fighters these days are not only versatile but can do things that were not there in a game. Switch stance faints and reads to so many variables it's crazy. Dom talked about it lately as well.
 
Originally posted by: Ja1862
Date: May 01, 2019 at 01:56 AM
Source: https://forum.mmajunkie.com/threads/ufc-236-poirier-vs-holloway-ii.73465/

Haraldr said:
I don't think he fought uncharacteristically, it's just that Poirier has a long reach and the power to hurt Holloway. Holloway usually gets in peoples faces and slightly move in and out of the way, but Poirier was able to reach him in a way that Holloway hasn't dealt with before. And Holloway probably underestimated Poirier's power, he barely gets dazed and he thought he could deal with it, which he could not.
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Very true, I was surprised that apart from rd 3 and a bit of rd 4 max wasn't able to get much going at all.
Constantly getting wobbled and hurt in every round.
When rd 5 came about I thought Dustin is slowly down but the amount of damage max had already taken Dustin was able to land more Sig strikes and control max.
Great win
 
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